[ale] OT need 600-1000W power protection for 3 minutes - cheap

[Ron Frazier (ALE)]

PS, these ups's only have about 300 joules of surge protection.  I've 
never understood why.  I would recommend putting a good media room surge 
protector first in line, with a 2000 - 3000 joule surge protection 
rating, then the ups.

Ron


On 7/9/2013 3:46 PM, Ron Frazier (ALE) wrote:
> Hi Alex,
>
> Thanks for the BR/BX explanation link.  It looks like the BR series 
> are better units.
>
> Would you like to acquire another Smart UPS?  Mine is an SMT-750 (750 
> VA / 500 W) less than 1 year old.  It works great and, as far as I 
> know, the batteries are in good shape.  However, the more advanced 
> features are beyond my needs and I do need the additional capacity of 
> a BR1500G.  The current amazon price is $ 272 for this unit.  I'll let 
> mine go for $ 200, which is a 25% discount.  I'll even deliver it 
> within 30 miles of my house (from Cumming, GA, exit 16 on GA 400).
>
> I probably shouldn't tell you this since I just asked you to buy this 
> unit.  But, according to http://www.apcupsd.com/ , this unit will only 
> communicate basic data to apcupsd, and will not communicate voltage, 
> frequency, etc.
>
> I was under the impression that computer power supplies were 
> essentially (or appear to be) resistive loads.  As an example, my pc 
> is currently running at a .98 power factor, almost as many watts as 
> VA.  In any case, it psychologically bothers me to have to look at a 
> box for an SMT-750, for example, and mentally convert and think, no, 
> that won't power my 530W load.  Oh well.
>
> By the way, for those of you who would like to track the storms in the 
> area in case you're worried about power glitches too, I've found a 
> couple of good ways to do that.  I'm sure there are others.
>
> Go here and get the Reload Every Firefox plugin and install it (if you 
> use Firefox): http://reloadevery.mozdev.org/  Or, you can use the 
> addons menu in Firefox.  There are many plugins with similar names 
> though.
>
> This will allow you to automatically refresh a web page on a schedule.
>
> Now, go here to the AccuWeather radar page: 
> http://www.accuweather.com/en/us/georgia/weather-radar
>
> If you wish, you may use this page as is.  However, I find it 
> convenient to search on my city.  This puts an image of a thumb tack 
> at my location.  If you want to do that, first type your city, state 
> into the search box and hit enter.  Ex: Cumming, GA.  Click the radar 
> tab on the right.  This goes to an animated page, which is not what I 
> want for my purposes.  Scroll down and click Classic Radar on the left 
> bottom.
>
> You should now have a static image of the south east radar with a 
> thumb tack at your location.
>
> Now, right click the tab you're viewing this in, select the reload 
> every menu, and select an update interval of say 5 min.  The page will 
> then refresh every 5 minutes.  You can confirm that the reload every 
> is active by going back into the menu.  You should find 5 min selected 
> and the "enable" box selected.  I don't think that it updates when the 
> screen saver is on, so the first time you come back after a while, you 
> may have to refresh the page manually.
>
> The problem with this page is that it shows 6 states at once and our 
> area is tiny.  So, as a final step, hit the ctrl + (control and the 
> plus key) sequence 8 times to zoom the page in.  You could also use 
> the mouse to go to the view menu, zoom, zoom in.  Now, visually adjust 
> the borders of the Firefox window to about 4" x 3" in size (or 
> whatever you want).  Adjust the scroll bars to show the area of the 
> state that you want.
>
> This is harder to type than to do.  Ta-Da, you now have an auto 
> updating customized radar picture for your area.  There may be other 
> radar sites where this works better, but this works for me.  If you 
> know of others, please share.  One problem is that some sites will 
> lose the scaling and position when the page is refreshed.  Other web 
> pages may show the roads and cities, etc.
>
> For Android, I highly recommend Storm Eye: 
> https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.cds.stormeye&hl=en
>
> It overlays the weather radar on a google map with cities and roads.  
> It shows the track of the storms and eta to your designated location.  
> And, it auto updates.
>
> Hope this is helpful.
>
> Sincerely,
>
> Ron
>
>
> On 7/9/2013 12:45 PM, Alex Carver wrote:
>> I have three APC SmartUPS and have no problem whatsoever with apcupsd 
>> finding them.  I get emails when the system goes on battery and the 
>> auto shutdown works fine across multiple machines with apcupsd 
>> sending data to other machines hanging off the same UPS running 
>> apcupsd in ethernet mode (no direct data connection to the UPS.)
>>
>> Here's your BR/BX explanation:  http://forums.apc.com/message/23515
>> The difference between the SMT and the BR/BX is the Smart Slot where 
>> you can add Smart Slot accessories like various management cards 
>> (ethernet) with temperature sensors, etc.  Both the SMT and BR/BX 
>> have the normal USB/serial data port for connecting to a single 
>> computer.  The Smart Slot just allows for direct ethernet connection 
>> and management by SNMP and APC's PowerChute software.
>>
>> Measuring in VA instead of W isn't marketing rubbish (entirely), it's 
>> proper engineering specification for AC circuits.  Unless your 
>> voltage and current are exactly in phase at all times with no 
>> distortions at all, Watts are meaningless unless you also specify VAr 
>> or the power factor.  Volt-Amps eliminates the need for the power 
>> factor because it represents the scalar length of the power phasor 
>> (vector) regardless of where it's pointing in W/VAr space (the 2pi 
>> radian range of phase angle.)
>>
>> Using volt-amps for the specification means that a power supply (the 
>> UPS in this case) can supply varying types of loads with different 
>> power factors and the total available apparent power (real and 
>> reactive/imaginary) is constant.  A 100 VA motor and a 100 VA light 
>> bulb require the same amount of apparent power.  The light bulb needs 
>> mostly real power and the motor needs mostly reactive power.
>>
>> Where the marketing comes in is the fact that the engineers are 
>> forced (by marketing drones) to pick an average power factor so they 
>> can label the object.  Typical switching supplies (prior to a 
>> concerted push against manufacturers by power companies to make them 
>> electrically cleaner) have a power factor of 0.6-0.8 and some really 
>> crappy Chinese knock-offs have power factors down near 0.4 with 
>> hideous harmonics.  APC assumes a power factor of somewhere around 
>> 0.65 for connected devices which is why your Watt rating is lower 
>> because some of the available VA must be used for the VAr portion of 
>> the load demand.
>>
>> On 7/9/2013 08:45, Ron Frazier (ALE) wrote:
>>
>>
>>> Hi all,
>>>
>>> To be honest, I need to save some money for this project, since, when
>>> spending $ 200 at a time, and multiple times, it adds up.  But, I hope
>>> to implement it soon.  I might be able to buy one new unit, and reduce
>>> the load on one pc to use my old ups with that.  Not sure yet.
>>>
>>> The more I think about my loads, the more I think I need a 1500 VA / ~
>>> 900W unit.  A 1200VA/~700W unit might do it, but most product lines 
>>> seem
>>> to jump to 1500 VA after 1000 VA.
>>>
>>> The last time I bought a UPS, it was from Frys.  I have no complaints,
>>> but you do pay sales tax and probably an intrinsically higher price. 
>>> The
>>> advantage is easier returns if needed.  I can't believe it, but I am
>>> actually considering mail ordering a UPS.  I understand from Amazon
>>> reviews on some, that you have to pay to ship it back to the factory if
>>> there is a problem, which can be expensive.
>>>
>>> Based on prior discussions and my experience, I know APC is a good
>>> brand.  I also understand that, for the "smart" units, it can be 
>>> hard to
>>> get linux to talk to it, if you want to use the auto shutdown software
>>> like apcupsd.  I think you guys told me before that Tripplite is good,
>>> so I may look at those.  Based on some amazon reviews and prior 
>>> comments
>>> here, it sounds like I should stay away from Cyberpower.
>>>
>>> I think it's total marketing rubbish that they rate these things by VA
>>> primarily.  My computer is currently pulling 539 VA and 532 W, 
>>> according
>>> to the Kill-A-Watt EZ, with a power factor of .98.  The UPS I have 
>>> is an
>>> SMT-750 so you would think it could handle the load.  But NO, that's 
>>> 750
>>> VA.  The watts are limited to 500, so the thing yells like crazy if I
>>> run this load on it.  (So I don't.)  So, it should be labeled SMT-500!
>>> That unit was capable of handling the load before I upped the load. 
>>> Yes,
>>> I do know what VA means.  It's just difficult to remember to cut
>>> whatever number I see on the box almost in half to get a realistic 
>>> load.
>>>
>>> Charles, thanks for the links.  I'll keep the buy batteries local idea
>>> in mind.  Might not be necessary with Amazon's free shipping.
>>>
>>> It's nice to see that the major makers are starting to come out with
>>> some bigger units, with some smarts, with more reasonable price tags.
>>>
>>> That Fry's link you posted is actually quite interesting.  I found it's
>>> bigger brother on Amazon.
>>>
>>> http://www.amazon.com/APC-BR1500G-BACK-UPS-10-Outlet-1500VA/dp/B003Y24DEU/ref=sr_1_1?s=electronics&ie=UTF8&qid=1373381258&sr=1-1&keywords=br1500g 
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> APC's different model numbers are confusing.  For example, I don't know
>>> the difference between a BR and a BX unit.
>>>
>>> This unit is a 1500 VA / 865 W unit, with lcd (or led or something)
>>> status display, and AVR (automatic voltage regulation [very cool]); for
>>> $ 179 with free shipping and no sales tax.  This unit has a BR part 
>>> number.
>>>
>>> This is at a price point / capacity point that's really starting to get
>>> my attention.
>>>
>>> Here's a similar unit at Frys.
>>>
>>> http://www.frys.com/product/5955004?site=sr:SEARCH:MAIN_RSLT_PG
>>>
>>> It has a BX part number.  Go figure.  The capacity is the same, but 
>>> it's
>>> $ 210, or $ 225 after sales tax.
>>>
>>> In any case, much better than the $ 500 Frys wants for the SMT-1500. 
>>> So,
>>> I guess the big question is, what do I give up by going with the BR/BG
>>> 1500 and saving $ 300 versus the SMT-1500?  I'll have to do some
>>> research on that.
>>>
>>> Alex, good point about the cooling.  If I'm using a stock battery and a
>>> name brand, it will probably be ok.  If I'm using a non standard
>>> battery, that may be something I have to look at.
>>>
>>
>>
>>
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>>
>

-- 

(PS - If you email me and don't get a quick response, you might want to
call on the phone.  I get about 300 emails per day from alternate energy
mailing lists and such.  I don't always see new email messages very quickly.)

Ron Frazier
770-205-9422 (O)   Leave a message.
linuxdude AT techstarship.com
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