[ale] More on LEDs...

Wed Aug 14 12:04:07 EDT 2013

Hi all,

A couple of years ago, the US govt decided to stop requiring the line 
frequency to be regulated so tightly.  I'm assuming they implemented the 
plan.  Most of the old news articles are gone, and I couldn't find much 
by googling.  I did find these:

http://wattsupwiththat.com/2011/06/25/it-hertz-when-you-do-that-power-grid-to-stop-regulating-60-hz-frequency/
http://www.eevblog.com/forum/chat/power-line-frequency-changes-may-lead-to-trouble-for-usa/
http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/tech/news/2011-06-24-power-grid-appliances-electronics_n.htm

I don't know for sure what the new standards are, but 58 Hz might be OK 
within the new guidelines.  Anyone know what the current actual 
standards are?

I think the standards are at this source, but I couldn't find them.

http://www.nerc.com/Pages/default.aspx

A modern grid tie inverter for home power will automatically synchronize 
to grid frequency within set limits.  Outside of those limits, it 
probably won't connect at all.

I checked the manual for an APC Smart UPS:

http://www.apcmedia.com/salestools/ASTE-6Z8LAM/ASTE-6Z8LAM_R0_EN.pdf

It's specs are 60 Hz +/- 5%, which works out to 57 Hz - 63 Hz.

PS Many people think they get 110 V from the wall outlet.  Actually, the 
standard for the US is 120 V / 240 V for single phase.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grid_power

The power running my computer right now is 120.2 V according to the 
Kill-A-Watt EZ.

Sincerely,

Ron

On 8/14/2013 10:29 AM, Jim Kinney wrote:
> That is REALLY BAD!!
>
> The one thing that power providers are REQUIRED to make is 60.0 Hz. 
> Otherwise BadThings happen to many, many devices (medical, media, 
> etc). They're not supposed to be able to inject into the grid without 
> a lock in at 60.0Hz. That's a big expense for home power to be able to 
> sell back excess into the grid is the gear to synchronize at 60.0Hz. 
> If the power is out of phase, it reduces the power available on the 
> grid and really pisses off all the other grid providers.
>
> So I think he got the problem wrong.
>
> Many providers don't provide a solid 110V (actually they provide 
> something around 125kV that gets transformered down to house 
> 110/220V.). A cost savings way to provide power is to be sloppy on the 
> output power - i.e. provide 109V or 108V.
>
> A power device expecting 110V and getting 109 or less loses efficiency 
> and often that will cost either excess heat (which lowers lifetime) or 
> simply produced less output (should not impact lifetime). My battery 
> backups _really_ don't like the generator I have as the bottom end of 
> the AC cycle is noisy and below 108V causing rapid switching. I was 
> able to adjust the kick-in voltage and save the batteries (ugh! all 
> due for replacement and $150+ each).
>
>
> On Wed, Aug 14, 2013 at 10:11 AM, Doug Hall <doughalldev at gmail.com 
> <mailto:doughalldev at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
>     I just had my air conditioner replaced yesterday, and the AC guy
>     said something that I thought was interesting. He said that
>     Alabama Power (my provider) was fairly good at producing power
>     inexpensively, but bad at distributing it. He said that rather
>     than the supposed 60hz that they're supposed to deliver, it's
>     usually a little less than that - say around 58-59Hz. It's usually
>     close enough to not fry everything from brownouts, but also low
>     enough to lower the longevity of things like these energy-saving
>     lights that are supposed to last ten years. This has been my
>     experience, by the way. They tend to go bad after a couple of
>     years (maybe).
>
>
>     On Tue, Aug 13, 2013 at 4:38 AM, Jim Lynch
>     <ale_nospam at fayettedigital.com
>     <mailto:ale_nospam at fayettedigital.com>> wrote:
>
>         On 08/12/2013 11:09 PM, Ron Frazier (ALE) wrote:
>
>             I wish I could figure out a way to participate in the led
>             market but the big box stores and online retailers
>             eliminate most of the possibilities for little guys.
>
>         There's always the niche markets, like RV and boat users  who
>         are looking for better ways to conserve power.
>
>         Jim.
>
>
>
>
> -- 
> -- 
> James P. Kinney III
> ////
> ////Every time you stop a school, you will have to build a jail. What 
> you gain at one end you lose at the other. It's like feeding a dog on 
> his own tail. It won't fatten the dog.
> - Speech 11/23/1900 Mark Twain
> ////
> http://heretothereideas.blogspot.com/
> ////
>    

-- 

(PS - If you email me and don't get a quick response, you might want to
call on the phone.  I get about 300 emails per day from alternate energy
mailing lists and such.  I don't always see new email messages very quickly.)

Ron Frazier
770-205-9422 (O)   Leave a message.
linuxdude AT techstarship.com
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